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Cold starting problems

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peter.rees01(at)tiscali.c
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 3:13 pm Post subject: Cold starting problems

We are still having tremendous problems getting HI started in the cold. 

We've replaced the battery but the engine still shakes violently when 

cranked and seems to run in whats been described as 'sub idle' before we 

execute a somewhat rapid shut down.



Once it has started, it runs very nicely - never missing a beat and it 

starts very well indeed when warm - on the button every time.



Trawling the archive gives me the very strong impression that our sprag 

clutch is due for the bin but I'd rathter get someone familiar with Rotax 

starting problems before changing such an expensive part (or getting it done 

more like!) and finding out that its one of the carbs!



Can anyone tell me - is it possible to remove the starter without taking the 

engine out in a 912 classic?



Conrad seems to be pretty well booked up at present - has anyone used Adrian 

Lloyd? If so (and he is any good) - does anyone have a contact number for 

him (or anyone else that can be recommended).



Really need to get this sorted before the starter or engine frame quits.



Thanks in anticipation



Peter

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paul.mcallister

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 177
Location: Waukesha, WI USA

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 5:11 pm Post subject: Cold starting problems

Peter,



Lockwood Aviation in the US recommend having the gearbox clutch adjusted

every 300 hours.  I sent mine in and they replaced it, I am assuming that

there wasn't any adjustment left.  It cost me about $140.00 including

freight to have the work done.



Paul

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rholder(at)avnet.co.uk
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:27 am Post subject: Cold starting problems

 	  Quote: 	
		   We are still having tremendous problems getting HI

 started in the cold. We've replaced the battery but the

 engine still shakes violently when cranked and seems to

 run in whats been described as 'sub idle' before we 

 execute a somewhat rapid shut down.


	


 	  Quote: 	
		   Trawling the archive gives me the very strong

 impression that our sprag clutch is due for the bin but

 I'd rathter get someone familiar with Rotax starting

 problems before changing such an expensive part (or

 getting it done more like!) and finding out that its

 one of the carbs!


	


 	  Quote: 	
		   Can anyone tell me - is it possible to remove the

 starter without taking the engine out in a 912 classic?

 

Mine is an XS firewall forward so I am not certain, but I
	


believe a starter motor out job on a classic f/f/w

requires engine out.



 	  Quote: 	
		   Conrad seems to be pretty well booked up at present -

 has anyone used Adrian Lloyd? If so (and he is any

 good) - does anyone have a contact number for him (or

 anyone else that can be recommended).


	


Adrian changed mine for me, in situ. I recommend him !



 	  Quote: 	
		   Really need to get this sorted before the starter or

 engine frame quits.


	


What I am nor sure of is whether the shaking is caused by

the worn sprag clutch or whether the worn sprag clutch has

been caused by the non-starting and kick-back.



The kick-back is caused by the starter just not being man

enough to do the job. (912S). Adrian put a HD starter on

for me and the engine starts instantly now.



If yours is a 912 then Peter Jeffers may help - he was

having similar problems and changed his sprag clutch at

around 1000 hours.



I understand that the HD starter motor will not fit inside

the classic engine mount. It is only a matter of 1/4 inch

or so. Maybe some judicious cutting and rewelding might

work (if approved !) or a large hammer ?



Richard

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nigelcharles(at)tiscali.c
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 11:40 am Post subject: Cold starting problems

 	  Quote: 	
		  >Can anyone tell me - is it possible to remove the starter without

taking the engine out in a 912 classic?<<
	




The Classic engine mount obscures the starter from removal with it in

situ. Its close proximity to the engine also means that the more

powerful starter cannot be fitted. Modifying the frame is not possible

as the area that needs modification also happens to be the position of

the head of the top starboard engine mount bolt. Any upgrade to the more

powerful starter means changing to the XS mount which means a full

upgrade to XS firewall forward. I have done this and the new starter

seems to solve the kickback problem. With this in mind I would say that

the combination of the Classic and the 912S is not good unless you like

regular sprag clutch replacements.

 	  Quote: 	
		  Conrad seems to be pretty well booked up at present - has anyone used

Adrian Lloyd? If so (and he is any good) - does anyone have a contact
	


number for him (or anyone else that can be recommended).<



Adrian replaced my sprag clutch for me. He has done quite a few now. I

can fully recommend him. His number is 01885 482504.



Regards



Nigel Charles

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peter.rees01(at)tiscali.c
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 12:15 pm Post subject: Cold starting problems

Hi Nigel



Thanks for the contact info - I'll give him a call.



Ours is a 912, not the 912s. I'll give Adrian a call and ask his opinion.



One thing I had thought of trying was to fine off the prop - its about 18 

degrees at the moment - maybe this is restricting the speed that the starter 

can turn the engine - Do you think this could be worth a try??



Thanks once again for contact info.



Peter

---

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nigelcharles(at)tiscali.c
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2006 2:15 pm Post subject: Cold starting problems

 	  Quote: 	
		  One thing I had thought of trying was to fine off the prop - its about

18 
	


degrees at the moment - maybe this is restricting the speed that the

starter 

can turn the engine - Do you think this could be worth a try??<



I doubt whether there is a significant change in drag for various prop

settings at such low rpm.



Nigel

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