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The ultimate door latch
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deruiteraircraftservices(
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 2:50 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

Doesn't it do the job? At no extra cost?

---

sbukolt(at)dstewart.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 6:28 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

I'm a rookie, so please excuse the ignorant question:



What is wrong with using seatbelt as a gust lock? From my novice

perspective it seems ideal:

1. Pretty fool proof if you use the left seatbelt. You can't sit in the

left seat with the "gust lock" in place, eliminating the potential for

error.

2. Seatbelts are handy and not in use for other purposes when gust locks

are needed (i.e. when the plane is not in use).

3. They work just as well as something you must build or pay

additionally for.



Please help me understand how this is inappropriate.



Scott

Scott Bukolt

RV-10 #40541 (Empenage kit arrived 1/23/06)

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Tdawson(at)avidyne.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:02 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

I guess it's a matter of taste.  Something like using tools only for the

jobs they were intended.  You can use a screwdriver as a crowbar, too,

if you want . . .



Then there's the aesthetics . . .



TDT

Do not archive

--

pilotdds(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:20 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

There is not a cessna on the ramp I cant unlock with a paperclip 

 

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sbukolt(at)dstewart.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:31 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

So if we renamed seatbelts simply "retention devices" they would become

appropriate and tasteful tools for use as gust locks?



I figured there was some integrity or safety issue. Perhaps I'm too

pragmatic. Also I thought of another important reason Seatbelts make

good locks. Weight. Why carry an extra ounce around with you if there is

no need?



Not trying to be argumentative, just learning.



sb

--

rvbuilder(at)sausen.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:50 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

This is an area a gave a very small amount of thought to so far.  Reason being because there is no way I'm going to leave a 50k panel with an unlocked door.  I am more than happy to replace a broken window or even an entire door if it might give an extra few minutes of work to a potential thief.  Thieves don't want to spend anytime in the open and will just walk away from a challenge 95% of the time.  But if they can simply walk up to an aircraft and climb in, shutting the door behind them, they will almost certainly pick that aircraft as a target.

  So I will use some method to restrict access to my -10 one way or another.  In addition I am planning on integrating the door warning system with a run of the mill auto alarm.  I'm sure some people are giggling but for less than the price of topping one of the tanks I can put in a loud alarm that will most certainly deter someone from targeting it.  Remember, deterrence is the best answer in almost all occasions.  An easy target has a much, much higher probability of being stolen.  There used to be a show on Discovery, don't recall the name, in which a pair of reformed thieves would go around to peoples homes and show them just how quickly they could steal them blind.  In the show the one thing they always tried to re-enforce was that a thief will not spend any amount of time at a house that they can not easily access and they would almost always keep walking if they knew it was alarmed.

  Just keep in mind the whole goal is deterrence because nothing will keep someone from breaking in if they want to.  You just need to make it a less attractive target.  We have a lot of theft around my in-laws ranch but no one has ever attempted to break into my workshop.  The primary reason is I made sure everyone around knows there is an alarm system on it that emails and pages a half a dozen people.  I then made sure that a few of the employees saw it in action. 

I may look like a dork when my aircraft flashes it's position lights when the alarm arms but I will sleep well knowing it will most likely be in the exact same condition the next morning, especially if some of you with no locks park near by. 

My $0.02 on the matter.

Michael Sausen

-10 #352 Fuselage

________________________________

From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Tim Olson

Sent: Mon 1/23/2006 9:54 PM

To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Re: The ultimate door latch

Gust lock = seat belt wrapped over the stick.

I'm on the fence regarding the door lock issue.  Of course,

I'd love to have a door lock.  But, Van's didn't make one, and

it gave me a chuckle to read the email that suggested that

they'd listen to our input and decide to offer them.  Perhaps

they would, but they'd be an add on cost item, for sure.

I myself still think a good idea is to use their door

latch warning system as a combination door latch warning

and alarm system.  People don't look too hard at

a car with beeping horn and blinking lights, but I bet

it would gain some quick attention on the ramp....and it would

prevent someone from doing extreme damage to your plane by

trying to pry open your locked doors.

That's only worth .01 cent, so I won't even give my .02. 

Tim

Eric Panning wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 I think Van's should provide it as an option/upgrade

 for the reasons Steve stated. I may not be so lucky as

 to have a hanger initially + I plan on traveling, etc.

 Not locking the plane is a bad solution. I think the

 insurance company would take issue with this approach

 when filing a claim. Also, what if they run off with

 the plane or worse yet fly it into a TFR or ADIZ, etc?

 I wouldn't want to have to explain to homeland

 security that the plane was unlocked....

 While Van's are at it, perhaps they can work on a gust

 lock for the stick?

 Eric

 DO NOT ARCHIVE

 --- Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com> wrote:

>

><jeff(at)westcottpress.com>

>

>I've seen it discussed here before... but consider

>the damage that 

>someone will do to your locked door to get at to

>your $35,000 panel.  

>It's arguably better to minimize the collateral

>damage to your plane 

>by not locking the door.  Perhaps a well secured

>cover (so they can't 

>tell what's in the plane to start with) is a better

>approach.

>

>Jeff Carpenter

>40304

>Top Skinning the Wings

>On Jan 23, 2006, at 1:21 PM, steveadams wrote:

>>

>><dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>

>>

>>Isn't it common sense that a plane with a mission

>

>profile like the 

>

>>RV-10 should have been designed with locking door

>

>latches? It's not 

>

>>a hanger queen designed to get pulled out for a

>

>short joy ride 

>

>>every Sunday afternoon.  Maybe instead of trying

>

>to jury rig a 

>

>>lock, or debating sending $700 overseas for

>

>something that looks 

>

>>good but may or may not work as specified, a

>

>little pressure on 

>

>>Vans from the builders would encourage them to

>

>design and build a 

>

>>locking latch that could at least be ordered as an

>

>option. They 

>

>>seem to have the resources to get something like

>

>that made up 

>

>>pretty quickly if they get the impression that it

>

>is important to 

>

>>their customers. Also, in general their prices are

>

>usually pretty 

>

>>reasonable. Just a suggestion.

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>Read this topic online here:

>>

>>

>

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6231#6231

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>

>

>browse

>Subscriptions page,

>FAQ,

>

>Admin.

>

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jjessen(at)rcn.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 8:15 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

I would like to have a keyed door, thank you.  It's a very odd thing to have

a $100,000 plus item with $35,000 plus worth of very saleable gear inside

(and these radios do get stolen) that can be flown away (these planes do get

stolen) and not at least give the builder an option to lock it when you are

parked out on the ramp.  Insurance again?  No IFR?  No locks?  I also will

have a throttle lock.  The only hanger I can really count on is my own.  



As for gust prevention, a seat belt is always usable, and I'm not against

using one, but I'm liking the idea of the items that were used out on the

flying surfaces and pictured a few posts ago.  Got to find out more.  



Finally, this RV-10 builders site is awfully quiet.  This must be one very

simple plane to put together.  Funny how good instructions and CNC matched

holed technology can make builders more productive.  I think after the -10

is together I'll just have to go build a -3.  



John Jessen

  ~ 328 (putting together my web site and bouncing back and forth from

elevators to tailcone)



--

Tim(at)MyRV10.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 10:51 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

You've got me thinking.....  Maybe I should just buy a pit-bull,

doberman, or maybe even a monitor lizard.



PS: I like the idea of those flashing position lights when you

arm the alarm.   One other additional thing that might be nice is

a little surface mount LED mounted on/by the door that has

a decal with the label "Alarm Armed".  Just that alone would

be a deterrent to many.  When I owned a business in a mall,

during a rash of breakins, we put in a simple door open alarm on

the back door, and a little green LED that said ARMED next to

it.  Both neighbors got hit, but we didn't.



Tim Olson -- RV-10  #40170

DO NOT ARCHIVE

RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   This is an area a gave a very small amount of thought to so far.

 Reason being because there is no way I'm going to leave a 50k panel

 with an unlocked door.  I am more than happy to replace a broken

 window or even an entire door if it might give an extra few minutes

 of work to a potential thief.  Thieves don't want to spend anytime in

 the open and will just walk away from a challenge 95% of the time.

 But if they can simply walk up to an aircraft and climb in, shutting

 the door behind them, they will almost certainly pick that aircraft

 as a target.

 

 So I will use some method to restrict access to my -10 one way or

 another.  In addition I am planning on integrating the door warning

 system with a run of the mill auto alarm.  I'm sure some people are

 giggling but for less than the price of topping one of the tanks I

 can put in a loud alarm that will most certainly deter someone from

 targeting it.  Remember, deterrence is the best answer in almost all

 occasions.  An easy target has a much, much higher probability of

 being stolen.  There used to be a show on Discovery, don't recall the

 name, in which a pair of reformed thieves would go around to peoples

 homes and show them just how quickly they could steal them blind.  In

 the show the one thing they always tried to re-enforce was that a

 thief will not spend any amount of time at a house that they can not

 easily access and they would almost always keep walking if they knew

 it was alarmed.

 

 Just keep in mind the whole goal is deterrence because nothing will

 keep someone from breaking in if they want to.  You just need to make

 it a less attractive target.  We have a lot of theft around my

 in-laws ranch but no one has ever attempted to break into my

 workshop.  The primary reason is I made sure everyone around knows

 there is an alarm system on it that emails and pages a half a dozen

 people.  I then made sure that a few of the employees saw it in

 action.

 

 I may look like a dork when my aircraft flashes it's position lights

 when the alarm arms but I will sleep well knowing it will most likely

 be in the exact same condition the next morning, especially if some

 of you with no locks park near by. 

 

 My $0.02 on the matter.

 

 

 Michael Sausen -10 #352 Fuselage

 

 

 ________________________________

 

 From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Tim Olson 

 Sent: Mon 1/23/2006 9:54 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re:

 Re: The ultimate door latch

 

 

 

 

 

 

 Gust lock = seat belt wrapped over the stick.

 

 I'm on the fence regarding the door lock issue.  Of course, I'd love

 to have a door lock.  But, Van's didn't make one, and it gave me a

 chuckle to read the email that suggested that they'd listen to our

 input and decide to offer them.  Perhaps they would, but they'd be an

 add on cost item, for sure. I myself still think a good idea is to

 use their door latch warning system as a combination door latch

 warning and alarm system.  People don't look too hard at a car with

 beeping horn and blinking lights, but I bet it would gain some quick

 attention on the ramp....and it would prevent someone from doing

 extreme damage to your plane by trying to pry open your locked doors.

 

 

 That's only worth .01 cent, so I won't even give my .02.  Tim

 

 Eric Panning wrote:

 

> 

> <ericmpmail-rv10(at)yahoo.com>

> 

> I think Van's should provide it as an option/upgrade for the

> reasons Steve stated. I may not be so lucky as to have a hanger

> initially + I plan on traveling, etc.

> 

> 

> Not locking the plane is a bad solution. I think the insurance

> company would take issue with this approach when filing a claim.

> Also, what if they run off with the plane or worse yet fly it into

> a TFR or ADIZ, etc? I wouldn't want to have to explain to homeland 

> security that the plane was unlocked....

> 

> While Van's are at it, perhaps they can work on a gust lock for the

> stick?

> 

> Eric

> 

> DO NOT ARCHIVE

> 

> 

> 

> --- Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com> wrote:

> 

> 

> 

>> 

>> <jeff(at)westcottpress.com>

>> 

>> I've seen it discussed here before... but consider the damage

>> that someone will do to your locked door to get at to your

>> $35,000 panel. It's arguably better to minimize the collateral 

>> damage to your plane by not locking the door.  Perhaps a well

>> secured cover (so they can't tell what's in the plane to start

>> with) is a better approach.

>> 

>> Jeff Carpenter 40304 Top Skinning the Wings

>> 

>> 

>> On Jan 23, 2006, at 1:21 PM, steveadams wrote:

>> 

>> 

>> 

>>> 

>>> <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>

>>> 

>>> Isn't it common sense that a plane with a mission

>> 

>> profile like the

>> 

>> 

>>> RV-10 should have been designed with locking door

>> 

>> latches? It's not

>> 

>> 

>>> a hanger queen designed to get pulled out for a

>> 

>> short joy ride

>> 

>> 

>>> every Sunday afternoon.  Maybe instead of trying

>> 

>> to jury rig a

>> 

>> 

>>> lock, or debating sending $700 overseas for

>> 

>> something that looks

>> 

>> 

>>> good but may or may not work as specified, a

>> 

>> little pressure on

>> 

>> 

>>> Vans from the builders would encourage them to

>> 

>> design and build a

>> 

>> 

>>> locking latch that could at least be ordered as an

>> 

>> option. They

>> 

>> 

>>> seem to have the resources to get something like

>> 

>> that made up

>> 

>> 

>>> pretty quickly if they get the impression that it

>> 

>> is important to

>> 

>> 

>>> their customers. Also, in general their prices are

>> 

>> usually pretty

>> 

>> 

>>> reasonable. Just a suggestion.

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> Read this topic online here:

>>> 

>>> 

>> 

> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6231#6231

> 

> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> browse Subscriptions page, FAQ,

>> 

>> Admin.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

 

 

 

 ==================================== 

 ==================================== 

 ====================================

Tdawson(at)avidyne.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 11:00 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

It would be cute to trigger the strobes if someone trips the alarm . . .



TDT



Do not archive

--

jjessen(at)rcn.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 11:20 am Post subject: The ultimate door latch

I like the LED idea!  Simple.  Cool looking if in cobalt blue.  



do not archive 



--

jhstarn(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 12:52 pm Post subject: The ultimate door latch

Just thought I'd trim posts of verbiage & Do Not Archive.

I mean we were working on page FOUR of a single thread.

The sky is falling, the sky is falling. "We are all going to die"

Not me I'm taking the Rocket (N561FS HRII) to the moon, no one has ever died 

on the moon so it must be a safe place...right ? ?   8*)    KABONG



---

jhstarn(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:03 pm Post subject: The ultimate door latch

Want/need to steal a car ? ?  Walk thru "Wal-Mart" parking lot & look for 

the unlocked car with the keys in it. Lock the door, windows up, red 

flashing on something and the opportunistic joyriding car thief was keep 

walking & looking. It's too easy to find one with the keys in it. Do Not 

Archive   KABONG  (ex-Det. Sgt Fontana PD)



--

jjessen(at)rcn.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:12 pm Post subject: The ultimate door latch

This thread is fine for me.  I have no clue what you're talking about.  



do not archive 



--

LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:21 pm Post subject: The ultimate door latch

In a message dated 1/23/2006, Tim(at)MyRV10.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  People don't look too hard at a car with beeping horn and blinking lights, but I bet

it would gain some quick attention on the ramp....and it would prevent someone from doing extreme damage to your plane by trying to pry open your locked doors. 	


 Makes me think... i always wanted a horn in my plane!

  

      

     As for prying doors open, prior to 9/11, the local flight school NEVER locked their planes so the plane would not get damaged from a thief and a crow bar. I think they have to lock them now.  The worst they would have to do was buy a new radio, far simpler then an airframe repair and a 337 report. .

  

 DO NOT ARCHIVE

Tdawson(at)avidyne.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:27 pm Post subject: The ultimate door latch

You mean, no one has ever died on the moon - THAT WE KNOW ABOUT!    : )



TDT

do not archive, please

--

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