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Aileron deflection angle

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asarangan(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 9:32 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

When attaching the ailerons to the wing, the manual calls for 25-deg up

and 22-deg down (for a final travel of 23.5-deg up and 20-deg down).



I don't have any problem with the 22-deg down, in fact, mine goes down

as far as 35-deg. But the up-swing is only about 20-deg. This is after

drilling holes for the anchor nuts to enter the leading edge of the

aileron. 



I am not sure how to get another 5-degrees. The manual does not address

this issue. Is there something I am missing??



Andrew Sarangan

http://www.sarangan.org

ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 11:28 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

Andrew,

Adjust the aileron bell crank settings to get the required displacements. I 

think the manual does mention this at the end.

Cheers,

Tim

Tim Ward

12 Waiwetu Street,

Fendalton,

Christchurch, 8005

New Zealand.

Ph +64 3 3515166

Mobile 021 0640221

ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz

---

Troy Maynor

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 162

Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:56 am Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<




When attaching the ailerons to the wing, the manual calls for 25-deg up

and 22-deg down (for a final travel of 23.5-deg up and 20-deg down).



I don't have any problem with the 22-deg down, in fact, mine goes down

as far as 35-deg. But the up-swing is only about 20-deg. This is after

drilling holes for the anchor nuts to enter the leading edge of the

aileron. 



I am not sure how to get another 5-degrees. The manual does not address

this issue. Is there something I am missing??



Andrew Sarangan

http://www.sarangan.org>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



Andrew,



I think shortening or lengthening the rod going through the wing will change

the setting. However, be aware that the mechanical stop that the bell crank

hits,(not the counter weight)is the limit for the opposite aileron. It was

an exercise in patience for me to say the least. 



Troy Maynor

N120EU Europa Monowheel Classic

Left to finish:

Paint,interior,engine install, wiring.

Weaverville, NC USA

asarangan(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:21 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

Jeremy,



That is exactly right. I am referring to the deflection without the

pushrods attached.

 

The gap between the hinged surfaces is more than the 1.5mm called for

in the manual; however, I have not checked whether that's where the

deflection is being restricted. 

I am assuming the neutral position (zero-degrees) to be when the

aileron is aligned with the trailing edge of the wingtip. I think that

makes sense because that would make the most streamlined situation to

be zero-degrees.





--- Jeremy Davey <europaflyer_3(at)msn.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <europaflyer_3(at)msn.com>

 

 I think what Andrew's saying is not that the pushrods won't allow him

 the

 movement, but that the aileron is fouling on the wing when he tries

 to get

 up deflection with the pushrods disconnected.

 

 Andrew, it sounds to me like you need to check the following:

 

 1) the positioning of your hinges - are they too close in?

 2) your start point for zero degrees deflection - are you starting

 from a

 few degrees out?

 

 I hope this helps.

 

 Kind regards,

 Jeremy

 

 Jeremy Davey

 Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA

 Europa Club Vice-Chairman, Webmaster, PFA NC Representative

 PFA EC Member

 "If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, then

 it is

 possible you haven't grasped the severity of the situation."

 Tail done

 Standard XS wings with mods underway

 CM installed in fuse (with airbrakes fittings)

 1430 build hours to date, build currently stalled due to house moves

 and

 lack of workshop

 Intended fit:

 Rotax 914 turbo, Airmaster CS fully-feathering prop

 Lots of lights, buttons, switches, gizmos, and alarms

 


	




Andrew Sarangan

http://www.sarangan.org

asarangan(at)YAHOO.COM
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 8:36 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

OK, I figured out where the aileron is getting snagged. It is rubbing

against the top surface of the aileron closeout (which is on the

trailing edge of the wing) throughout its entire range of motion. This

is what is restricting its max travel to 20-degrees. I can even see

where this rubbing pressure has even lifted portions of the closeout

skin that used to be bonded to the sides at the root end of this

closeout.



One solution is to trim about 5mm from the closeout's upper lip.

However, I am not sure if this will cause any problems when bonding the

top skin on. Any ideas are appreciated.

--- Andrew Sarangan <asarangan(at)yahoo.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <asarangan(at)yahoo.com>

 

 Jeremy,

 

 That is exactly right. I am referring to the deflection without the

 pushrods attached.

  

 The gap between the hinged surfaces is more than the 1.5mm called for

 in the manual; however, I have not checked whether that's where the

 deflection is being restricted. 

 I am assuming the neutral position (zero-degrees) to be when the

 aileron is aligned with the trailing edge of the wingtip. I think

 that

 makes sense because that would make the most streamlined situation to

 be zero-degrees.

 

 

 

 

 --- Jeremy Davey <europaflyer_3(at)msn.com> wrote:

 

 > 

 > <europaflyer_3(at)msn.com>

 > 

 > I think what Andrew's saying is not that the pushrods won't allow

 him

 > the

 > movement, but that the aileron is fouling on the wing when he tries

 > to get

 > up deflection with the pushrods disconnected.

 > 

 > Andrew, it sounds to me like you need to check the following:

 > 

 > 1) the positioning of your hinges - are they too close in?

 > 2) your start point for zero degrees deflection - are you starting

 > from a

 > few degrees out?

 > 

 > I hope this helps.

 > 

 > Kind regards,

 > Jeremy

 > 

 > Jeremy Davey

 > Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA

 > Europa Club Vice-Chairman, Webmaster, PFA NC Representative

 > PFA EC Member

 > "If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs,

 then

 > it is

 > possible you haven't grasped the severity of the situation."

 > Tail done

 > Standard XS wings with mods underway

 > CM installed in fuse (with airbrakes fittings)

 > 1430 build hours to date, build currently stalled due to house

 moves

 > and

 > lack of workshop

 > Intended fit:

 > Rotax 914 turbo, Airmaster CS fully-feathering prop

 > Lots of lights, buttons, switches, gizmos, and alarms

 > 

 

 

 Andrew Sarangan

 http://www.sarangan.org

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

  

  

 

 

 

 


	




Andrew Sarangan

http://www.sarangan.org

dglauser(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 8:49 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

Let it rub for now. When applying the top skin, you can use mixing

sticks to provide space between the aileron and the closeout. Any

subsequent rubbing can be handled by removing a bit of the trailing

edge of the closeout.



I trimmed mine back and thought all was well. Then when it came time

to bond the top on I found I did not have enough bonding area and the

top skin was not firmly on in places. (Inspection was done with a

small "lipstick" TV camera placed in the wing through the access

panels.) I ended up having to cut more access panels, apply more

epoxy/glass and adhesive through them, reinforce the panel edges, and

reinstall the skin cutouts. A royal pain.



David



On 3/21/06, Andrew Sarangan <asarangan(at)yahoo.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 OK, I figured out where the aileron is getting snagged. It is rubbing

 against the top surface of the aileron closeout (which is on the

 trailing edge of the wing) throughout its entire range of motion. This

 is what is restricting its max travel to 20-degrees. I can even see

 where this rubbing pressure has even lifted portions of the closeout

 skin that used to be bonded to the sides at the root end of this

 closeout.



 One solution is to trim about 5mm from the closeout's upper lip.

 However, I am not sure if this will cause any problems when bonding the

 top skin on. Any ideas are appreciated.

 --- Andrew Sarangan <asarangan(at)yahoo.com> wrote:



 > 

 > <asarangan(at)yahoo.com>

 >

 > Jeremy,

 >

 > That is exactly right. I am referring to the deflection without the

 > pushrods attached.

 >

 > The gap between the hinged surfaces is more than the 1.5mm called for

 > in the manual; however, I have not checked whether that's where the

 > deflection is being restricted.

 > I am assuming the neutral position (zero-degrees) to be when the

 > aileron is aligned with the trailing edge of the wingtip. I think

 > that

 > makes sense because that would make the most streamlined situation to

 > be zero-degrees.

 >

 >

 >

 >

 > --- Jeremy Davey <europaflyer_3(at)msn.com> wrote:

 >

 > > 

 > > <europaflyer_3(at)msn.com>

 > >

 > > I think what Andrew's saying is not that the pushrods won't allow

 > him

 > > the

 > > movement, but that the aileron is fouling on the wing when he tries

 > > to get

 > > up deflection with the pushrods disconnected.

 > >

 > > Andrew, it sounds to me like you need to check the following:

 > >

 > > 1) the positioning of your hinges - are they too close in?

 > > 2) your start point for zero degrees deflection - are you starting

 > > from a

 > > few degrees out?

 > >

 > > I hope this helps.

 > >

 > > Kind regards,

 > > Jeremy

 > >

 > > Jeremy Davey

 > > Europa Monowheel 537M G-EZZA

 > > Europa Club Vice-Chairman, Webmaster, PFA NC Representative

 > > PFA EC Member

 > > "If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs,

 > then

 > > it is

 > > possible you haven't grasped the severity of the situation."

 > > Tail done

 > > Standard XS wings with mods underway

 > > CM installed in fuse (with airbrakes fittings)

 > > 1430 build hours to date, build currently stalled due to house

 > moves

 > > and

 > > lack of workshop

 > > Intended fit:

 > > Rotax 914 turbo, Airmaster CS fully-feathering prop

 > > Lots of lights, buttons, switches, gizmos, and alarms

 > >

 >

 >

 > Andrew Sarangan

 > http://www.sarangan.org

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 Andrew Sarangan

 http://www.sarangan.org

Roger.Mills(at)btinternet
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:58 am Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

It might just be worth checking the Europa service bulletins - a batch of XS

wings were made with the close-out fixed too far towards the trailing edge

and this would certainly have an impact on the available deflection. 



The fix is to remove the close out and re-install slightly further forward.

I forget the service bulletin number but a check with Roger or Andy at the

factory might be wise.



Regards



Roger Mills



G-BVUV

keithhickling(at)clear.ne
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:58 am Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

Andrew,

I have just done this part too. I found the main restriction on aileron 

deflection occurred where the upper aileron closeout joins the wingtip 

moulding.  Most of the upper closeout can move upwards a little with the 

aileron, but at the tip where it is tethered it can not move. I found that 

cutting forwards a few mm where the rear edge of the upper closeout joins 

the tip moulding allowed sufficient upward deflection of the aileron without 

having to actually trim the closeout  (even though the aileron continues to 

rub on the upper closeout - it is meant to do that at this stage).



Regards,

Keith

---

asarangan(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 10:55 am Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

I wish the manual had mentioned that the rubbing motion is normal at

this stage. Any kind of rubbing would seem abnormal unless mentioned.

Also, reading ahead, I saw that you are supposed to trim the close-out

skin along with the wing skin after the top skin is bonded on. 



On my wing, the main restriction to the aileron deflection is at the

root end, where the upper closeout is bonded to an end-cap. I spoke to

Andy at Europa, and he said that the end-cap is not that critical, and

I could snip the joint to relieve the pressure. 

--- Keith Hickling <keithhickling(at)clear.net.nz> wrote:



[quote] 

 <keithhickling(at)clear.net.nz>

 

 Andrew,

 I have just done this part too. I found the main restriction on

 aileron 

 deflection occurred where the upper aileron closeout joins the

 wingtip 

 moulding.  Most of the upper closeout can move upwards a little with

 the 

 aileron, but at the tip where it is tethered it can not move. I found

 that 

 cutting forwards a few mm where the rear edge of the upper closeout

 joins 

 the tip moulding allowed sufficient upward deflection of the aileron

 without 

 having to actually trim the closeout  (even though the aileron

 continues to 

 rub on the upper closeout - it is meant to do that at this stage).

 

 Regards,

 Keith

 

 

 ---

wdaniell(at)etb.net.co
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:05 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

My aileron channels were too closed - apprently some came out like that.

Nev recommended that you could cut the flange to a minimum of 5/8 - although

you might want to check with Nev about that.



In the end the despite cutting back, the "closing" of the channel led to a

1/4 gap between the top skin and the channel flange. The aileron channel was

far too strong to be bent by force.  So I applied heat and opene the channel

to the right proflie and then reinforced with bid. 



--

jan.de.jong(at)xs4all.nl
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 3:07 pm Post subject: Aileron deflection angle

Andrew,



On the subject of making room for deflection and lining up the upper 

wing skin. What Neville wrote:

http://www.sarangan.org/~sarangan/mharc/html//europa-list/2003-05/msg00052.html



Make sure not to get below the 1/2" mentioned...



Jan de Jong

461, 2nd wing

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