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Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION
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partner14

Joined: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 540
Location: Granbury Texas

Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:34 pm Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

You are a riot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Drop by some time and I'll take you through the shop.  They have about 3 times the equipment Van's has.  Just fly into Mather.... the ole AFB.



--- On Mon, 10/13/08, Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> wrote:

 [quote]From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>

Subject: Re: Re: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Monday, October 13, 2008, 7:18 PM



[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>  Ummm... yeah...how much do those 12 year old welders get an hour? do not archive ---

_________________
Don A. McDonald
40636

msausen

Joined: 25 Oct 2007
Posts: 559
Location: Appleton, WI USA

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:53 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

BTW if anyone is interested in what you can do with the Andair valve and extension, here is a picture.  I just set the scat tube in to take a picture but you can see that it clears the valve no problem.  I secured the faceplate and valve handle with extension to the tunnel cover.  When it's in place and screwed down the tunnel cover will not let the extension disengage from the valve.



Michael



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johngoodman

Joined: 18 Sep 2006
Posts: 530
Location: GA

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:05 am Post subject: Re: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

Don,

I definitely want one. I'll send my mailing address in an e-mail. As far as the other issues brought up I'm a little puzzled. For instance, I noticed a disparaging remark about Van's supplied fuel valve. Is there something wrong with it? Does it leak or something? Is it missing a selection option? I suspect that it's simply "not pretty." In which case, a new handle ought to solve the problem for most of us.

The fuel heating issue that Tim brought up got my attention. I could see a small amount of heat transfer at the current location of the scat tube, but the fuel is only exposed for a second or two at the valve. To me the fuel filter, fuel pump, and flowscan attached directly to the belly skin would be far more significant. I'm assuming that the tunnel heat issue has never really gone away.

The advantage of your device is that twice as much air flow is allowed around the fuel valve - unless somebody has perfected a way to squash the scat tube on both sides of the valve stem. Because of the increased flow, the folks in the back would probably want it on a shorter period of time.

John

_________________
#40572 Phase One complete in 2011

dlm46007(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 7:26 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

IIRC the vans valve does not lock in a given position; no positive detent

for left or right or off. It could be nudged and inadvertently to off or to

some intermediate position in flight? 



--

msausen

Joined: 25 Oct 2007
Posts: 559
Location: Appleton, WI USA

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 9:20 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

I've also heard that in the past they have leaked over time.  I believe some people were replacing the seals in it proactively with better ones.



Michael



--

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2882

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 10:11 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

I don't think I've ever heard of them leaking over time on the

RV-10's, but I know that if you put tons of interior covering

on your doors they may not hold up the door. (this is true)



To save mine from being compressed all the time, I had a

special canopy cover made that allows me to park it with

the doors open and have the plane covered. (tongue in cheek,

beware, this is actually NOT true, for those who haven't

figured that out)



Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>

 

 I've also heard that in the past they have leaked over time.  I

 believe some people were replacing the seals in it proactively with

 better ones.

 

 Michael

jesse(at)saintaviation.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

I have seen some of these weaker than others, but I don't think it is  

a leak.  Van's has been pretty good about replacing them if/when they  

fall short of the mark.



All that said, I don't think I've had a problem in a while, so they  

may have changed sources.



do not archive



Jesse Saint

Saint Aviation, Inc.

jesse(at)saintaviation.com

Cell: 352-427-0285

Fax: 815-377-3694



On Oct 14, 2008, at 2:10 PM, Tim Olson wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I don't think I've ever heard of them leaking over time on the

 RV-10's, but I know that if you put tons of interior covering

 on your doors they may not hold up the door. (this is true)



 To save mine from being compressed all the time, I had a

 special canopy cover made that allows me to park it with

 the doors open and have the plane covered. (tongue in cheek,

 beware, this is actually NOT true, for those who haven't

 figured that out)



 Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

 do not archive

 RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:

> 

> <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>

> I've also heard that in the past they have leaked over time.  I

> believe some people were replacing the seals in it proactively with

> better ones.

> Michael

planesmith(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 12:00 pm Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

Too Cool!

  

 Is the canopy cover available with zip-in screen doors? It would be great for those hot days at air shows:)

  

 Vern Smith (#324 finishing)

   

 > Date: Tue C 14 Oct 2008 13:10:29 -0500

 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Tim(at)MyRV10.com

 To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Re: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

 

 --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim(at)myrv10.com>

 


	


 	  Quote: 	
		   

 To save mine from being compressed all the time C I had a

 special canopy cover made that allows me to park it with

 the doors open and have the plane covered. (tongue in cheek C

 beware C this is actually NOT true C for those who haven't

 figured that out)

 

 Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

 do not archive


	


See how Windows connects the people C information C and fun that are part of your life. See Now  [quote][b]

ricksked(at)embarqmail.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 5:41 pm Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

John,



The disparaging remark came from me...and about half of the flying RV's out there. You can search Vansairforce list and read about the shortcomings or the lack of them. Seems the valve has a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde reputation. It either outlasts the the airframe or it leaks in 30 to 40 hours. I mean really, look at that valve. I wouldn't trust it on my icemaker, which did $20k  in water damage to my house at one time. The Andair is my choice and you decide for yourself what you want controlling the fuel. If you have had the chance to examine both there would be no question which you would choose. But then again....some guys love the (cough, gag) Vans valve, including Van, but you need to consider the Dutch factor there, you know, if it leaks I still have 5000 of them in the warehouse and we recommend them all the way up till they are all sold!  



Rick Sked

40185



---

johngoodman

Joined: 18 Sep 2006
Posts: 530
Location: GA

Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 7:28 am Post subject: Re: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

Rick,

I have started doing my homework on it right now. I've gone to our local RV hangar and took a good look at the Andairs that were there, still in the box and some installed.  I definitely think the Andair is an excellent looking valve and has a very nice feel to it. I was also told by one of experienced builders that the Vans valve has been known to stick at one tank position, or the other. The leak issue is also mentioned. A quick browse through the VAF forums reveals that the standard brass/nylon valve can wear to create the above situations but it is not common. Most folks believe the valve is extremely reliable - albeit ugly.



So now I have a dilemma. IF I switch over, it looks like I would have to re-plumb my fuel lines. I'm also guessing that it would mount differently than the Van's valve requiring removal of the old bracket and fabrication of a new one. It appears the scat tube issue that I was hoping to solve with Don's device is still there, so would Don's device work? The extension on the Andair looks like a solution but it's an additional layer of complexity and would cost more to buy than the replacement cost of Van's valve.



If only Van had found a better way to get the scat tube to the back seats, I would still be in ignorant bliss......

John



 	  ricksked(at)embarqmail.co wrote: 	
		  John,



The disparaging remark came from me...and about half of the flying RV's out there. You can search Vansairforce list and read about the shortcomings or the lack of them. Seems the valve has a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde reputation. It either outlasts the the airframe or it leaks in 30 to 40 hours. I mean really, look at that valve. I wouldn't trust it on my icemaker, which did $20k  in water damage to my house at one time. The Andair is my choice and you decide for yourself what you want controlling the fuel. If you have had the chance to examine both there would be no question which you would choose. But then again....some guys love the (cough, gag) Vans valve, including Van, but you need to consider the Dutch factor there, you know, if it leaks I still have 5000 of them in the warehouse and we recommend them all the way up till they are all sold!  



Rick Sked

40185



---

_________________
#40572 Phase One complete in 2011

ricksked(at)embarqmail.co
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 11:22 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

John,



For sure you will need to modify your install if you already plumbed for the weathervane. I only intalled the mount before electing to use the Andair. My install was pretty simple using the braided stainless lines instead of the hard aluminum. This allowed me to route the lines to one side of the tunnel and the scat along the other but it still needed to flatten it a little a little. My valve stands up in the tunnel withthe assistance of the aluminum line that goes to the fuel pump. The valve is secured when the figerglass console is installed and the mounting screws for the valve go through the plate and console and into the nutplates on the valve. very secure and stable mount using the glass console. It's about 1/4" thick at the point where the valve mounts.



Rick Sked

40185

---

jump2(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 11:59 am Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

Hey Rick here is the solution one of our local RV10 builder has. Don't install a back Heat outlet.

Patrick Thyssen

 PS: It's a cheap fix

--- On Wed, 10/15/08, Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> wrote:



 [quote]From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>

Subject: Re: Re: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 2:21 PM



[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>  John,  For sure you will need to modify your install if you already plumbed for the weathervane. I only intalled the mount before electing to use the Andair. My install was pretty simple using the braided stainless lines instead of the hard aluminum. This allowed me to route the lines to one side of the tunnel and the scat along the other but it still needed to flatten it a little a little. My valve stands up in the tunnel withthe assistance of the aluminum line that goes to the fuel pump. The valve is secured when the figerglass console is installed and the mounting screws for the valve go through the plate and console and into the nutplates on the valve. very secure and stable mount using the glass console. It's about 1/4" thick at the point where the valve mounts.  Rick Sked 40185 ---

ricksked(at)embarqmail.co
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:25 pm Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

Yeah but it get so chilly here in Las Vegas...I really don't plan much back seat pass. So I did give that some consideration...Tim on the other hand has his girls and it is REALLY cold in his part of the country.

---

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2882

Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:45 pm Post subject: Rear Heat Duct (Scat Tube) - SOLUTION

 Yeah, we use it all the time.  On the way to Philly we had

it on this last week.  I actually like using the rear heat

more often than the front.  It allows them to be warm,

and you to get warmth without that direct leg-heat that

tends to put me to sleep.   It also keeps the heat from

blowing up under the panel. I  remember back to my flyoff

time, flying along at 10F, but I could see that the internal

temp of my GRT EIS was like 110F, and that box doesn't get

that warm on it's own.  The head from the inlet was rising

up to the panel.



On a continued topic, I would really recommend that everyone

put in defroster fans on their RV-10's, regardless of their

climate.  Even if you don't need defrost, it will help keep

the hot air from collecting under your forward fuselage

behind the panel.



Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

Rick Sked wrote:

[quote] Yeah but it get so chilly here in Las Vegas...I really don't plan much 

 back seat pass. So I did give that some consideration...Tim on the other 

 hand has his girls and it is REALLY cold in his part of the country.

 ---

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