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williamtsullivan(at)att.n
Guest

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:14 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: platypus hop

Vic- Be very careful!  I still have reason to believe that Kolbs can be airborne at far below the published stall speeds.  When you lift off at extremely low speeds it would take only a slight breeze to overcome the control established by the airflow.  Be very alert as to the direction and speed of the wind, especially if it's variable.  I do not know how to initiate or recover from a crow hop, as I never asked about it.

   I now believe that I know what happened to me, and I don't think it was as I first related.  I had my wife look at an aerial photo of the field, and asked her where I took off, and what direction I was going when the lift-off occurred.  Apparently I had finished taxiing and had started turning to my right when the left wing started the lift-off.  I had also been in the habit of keeping the stick firmly to the rear while taxiing.  I had also gotten into the habit of using the ailerons to counter any leaning while making a tight turn.  In the Firestar the stick had to go forward to accomplish this- all the way back, it was trapped in the "V" of my legs.  The tail popped up with the stick forward a bit, and right aileron.  I immediately pulled the stick back to put the tail down, and the plane popped up while heading for an embankment with vertical vent pipes.  As I had been advised, I went to full  throttle, and the Firestar climbed at an incredible rate and steep angle.  This part had always confused me, because I had looked down and saw trees that I knew were off to the right.  Now I know that the lift-off had caused a turn that brought me to an angle of more than 90 degrees to the right of the runway.  I noted the ASI was inoperative, and brought the nose down to avoid a stall.  I took it up to 750 feet- no more, as the cloud cover was about 1200.  I leveled out and throttled back to about 5500 to make a turn to my left and re-align with the runway.  The air was very rough.  I decided to make a fast pass at the runway to check handling.  I couldn't have asked for a sweeter handling plane- no quirks other than the sensation of sitting in the nosecone of a missile while climbing!  After the fast pass, I checked the windsock- little wind.  I circled around to line up with the runway, and decided  to  fly in on.  Rpm's were 5000, and I aimed it for a touch-down spot.  Speed unknown, but it stayed aimed at that spot.  When I got a couple of feet off the ground it seemed to go into ground effect, and "floated".  I now know that instead of cutting back on the throttle, I forced it down by pushing the stick forward.  The right gear bent back, and the nose hit, cartwheeling.  I don't remember impact, or crawling out after my wife ran over and released the seat belt.  Next thing I saw was an EMT looking down at me.  No pain, but dirt in my eyes.

   I would rate the accuracy of the above at about 80% or better- some is guesswork, and some I remembered just as I woke up one day about a month ago.  In all probability, what I thought to be a gust was just the sudden lift, or an assist from a slight gust.

   Advice for beginners:  Don't do what I did- high lift wing, and no brakes.  I had told everyone I was a beginner, but I don't think I emphasized it enough.  Ignorance was my biggest mistake, and possibly complacency.  Get someone else to try taxiing your plane before you do, and make sure they are about the same weight.  Let an experienced pilot give you the safe RPM's to taxi.  I had been observed by experienced people who knew I was an beginner, but they did not think I was going too fast.  Appearances can be deceptive.  Always use the seatbelt/harness, every time the motor is running (I did- habit).  If you don't have a radio, and know how to use it, bring a cell phone with the number of an experienced pilot (I didn't- I was being a mechanic, and saw no need for it).  Another mistake I made-  I went up with a full tank of gas, and came back with it.  The plane didn't fall apart in  the first 5 minutes, so I should have used it to really get comfortable with the plane.  I had a BRS, and if it was going to do something drastic I was at an altitude to use it.  I ended up landing upside down with a full tank- no spillage, but might have saved me some pain if I had gotten a little more familiar with it.  Bring a watch- I didn't.  No gas gauge, and no communications, so I didn't know how long I had.  Later found out the flight was only about 8 minutes.  I also should have kept the nav bearings for a long field on me, as the field looked quite short for a beginner in trouble.  This may have influenced my decision to stuff it in.

   I had just taken my first refresher flight in years, and I goofed again.  When the instructor asked me what I wanted to start with, I said, "familiarization and orientation" (What's this knob do?, and Where are we?).  I should have shot touch and goes, which is where I left off 40 years ago.

   Anybody else have something I missed?  I deeply appreciate any and all criticism and additions, especially for the benefit of any lurkers or beginners.

  

                                                     Bill Sullivan

                                                     Windsor Locks, Ct.

                                                     Bent Firestar, under repair



 [quote][b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:32 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: platypus hop

Bill S:

  

 There are no "official" published stall speeds for  Kolbs, that I know of.  Most all are a little different based on weight of  airplane and pilot.

  

 Airplanes do not fly below stall  speeds.

  

 I mentioned to Vic the other day on the Kolb List,  taxi speeds, to me, are perceived ground speeds of a fast walk or  less, not 25 to 30 mph.  Anything faster than that, and you are either  transitioning from a landing or taking off.

  

 High speed taxiing in an unfamiliar airplane by an  unqualified, untrained student pilot from 40 years ago, is an accident that will  happen.  I believe you mentioned you were a very low time student pilot,  but I may be mistaken.

  

 I think it is readily evident why you crashed, you  don't know how to fly.  How you crashed is irrevalent.

  

 Right now I can not think of one good reason for  you to be in the airplane running up and down the airstrip in the first  place.  But I am sure you can.

  

 If I was in your shoes, I wouldn't think of getting  in another airplane unless there was an instructor pilot in there with  me.

  

 Bill S said, "Anybody else have something I missed?"  John H  said, "Yes, the training!!!"

  

  

  

 john h

 mkIII

  

  

 [quote]    

                                                          Vic- Be very careful!  I still have reason to believe          that Kolbs can be airborne at far below the published stall          speeds.   

          

          I should have shot touch and goes, which is where I left off          40 years ago.

          

           Anybody else have something I missed?  I deeply          appreciate any and all criticism and additions, especially for the          benefit of any lurkers or beginners.

          

                                                                      Bill Sullivan

                                                                      



 	  Quote: 	
		  

 	
[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

williamtsullivan(at)att.n
Guest

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:05 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

John- I agree.  We (the students) were given permission for slow taxiing.  I would not know how slow was slow, or how fast was dangerous.  I am listing every possible mistake I've made so that other's won't make the same ones.  Please continue with the comments.  

                                              Thank You

                                       

                                                     Bill Sullivan

 [quote][b]

henry.voris

Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 116
Location: Pueo Field, Kula, Maui

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Kolb List re: platypus hop

27sep08



Vic,



Way back in '06 when I soloed I did some high speed taxiing... I had Jim Hefner post my an account of my experience. So as not to bore the rest of the rest of the list with my sillyness I've attached a link to that posting. My comments are the second post in the thread... And my thoughts on high speed taxiing haven't changed.



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=16310&highlight=



Also... If Dr.Hauck were to pontificate on my flying... I'd genuflect smartly and proceed as advised. 



Good luck. I hope you're flying soon. It's the second greatest thrill known to man... Landing is number one.



Aloha,

Henry Voris

FireFly Five-Charlie-Bravo

_________________
Henry
Firefly Five-Charlie-Bravo

Do Not Archive

aoldman(at)xtra.co.nz
Guest

Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:36 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

William ,it is great to to hear from some one that  is so open and willing to share their mistakes so others may learn. It is also  really good you did not damage your self beyound repair. I can understand  the desire to aviate and find it difficult to chastise anyone that finds  themselves in a place they would rather not be . Have been there, like the day I  hit  a real  southerly front and went from 500ft to 1500 in the bat of  an eyelid then lost the same 1000 just as fast. The spare helmet was glued  to the cockpit roof . As I was flying directly into the wind I desided to head  home , from the time I started the turn to the timr I came out of it I had  covered about 1 mile .Arrived back at the airport and had to use full throttle  ,stick hard forward just to get to the ground. Good thing some flying savy  people were there when I landed. Very short landing roll ,touch ground ,kill the  power and stop. The people that watched  me come in were there to grab the wings, drape a body across the tail boom   and assist me back to the hanger . The tower gave a gusting wind speed of 35 mph  when I landed . that is about my stall speed .  The game we play can  be very unforgiving . Did I learn anything from my experiance, well yes ,just  because the weather was really calm when I took off the indications were there  that it was going to change, so I should have used my judgment on the weather as  opposed to my desire to go flying and I also learned that Kolbs can fly  backwards, as I was on short finals and reduced power the runway was getting  further away.  

  

 Many regards

                     Downunder

                     Kolb MK111    

 [quote]   ---

williamtsullivan(at)att.n
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:10 am Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

Tony-  Now that is scary!  I was at a small air show about 25 years ago, and a demo pilot from Pioneer Parachute was flying one of their chute equipped ultralights.  The wind was blowing strong but consistant straight down the runway.  He adjusted his throttle, and hovered about 30 feet up for about 10 minutes. He would have had no trouble flying backwards. 

   I had made the exact same run about 50 times without any trouble.  Same rpm, equipment, etc.  This is why I believe a gust was responsible for the actual airspeed necessary to lift off.  I had a full enclosure, so I never felt wind.  The vertical embankment was only about 30 feet away. and went up maybe 12 feet or so.  The runway sits in a man-made depression at an old dump. 

   John re-capped my previous experience.  I had taken lessons for a short time about 40 years ago, but stopped because of an injury.  I was starting over again, now that I had the time and money.  Once again- I am not a pilot!!!

   I grade my memory at only about 80% sure because I was knocked out, and the memories are fragmented.  I would rather be criticized than have to go to somebody's funeral.  Been there, done that, and a friend was very messily dead.  He got hit by a car while attending to a broken down truck- not alert enough.  Sometimes warnings aren't adequate, sometimes things just happen.

  

                                              Bill Sullivan 

 [quote][b]

aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:51 am Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

Bill, At least here on the forum, I see no one has answered your question about how fast to taxi. I'll give you the answer as it has been drilled into me by every flight instructor I've ever trained with. Walking speed. Taxi as fast as you walk. Not jog, not trot, not run. Walk. Which makes taxiing about as much fun as riding a garden tractor, as it should be. If your instructor didn't explain this to you, give serious thought to finding a new instructor. If he didn't give you explicit instruction when he released you to do slow taxiing, in what else has he been remiss? 



Rick

do not archive



On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 8:09 AM, william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net (williamtsullivan(at)att.net)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		    Tony-  Now that is scary!  I was at a small air show about 25 years ago, and a demo pilot from Pioneer Parachute was flying one of their chute equipped ultralights.  The wind was blowing strong but consistant straight down the runway.  He adjusted his throttle, and hovered about 30 feet up for about 10 minutes. He would have had no trouble flying backwards. 

    I had made the exact same run about 50 times without any trouble.  Same rpm, equipment, etc.  This is why I believe a gust was responsible for the actual airspeed necessary to lift off.  I had a full enclosure, so I never felt wind.  The vertical embankment was only about 30 feet away. and went up maybe 12 feet or so.  The runway sits in a man-made depression at an old dump. 

    John re-capped my previous experience.  I had taken lessons for a short time about 40 years ago, but stopped because of an injury.  I was starting over again, now that I had the time and money.  Once again- I am not a pilot!!!

    I grade my memory at only about 80% sure because I was knocked out, and the memories are fragmented.  I would rather be criticized than have to go to somebody's funeral.  Been there, done that, and a friend was very messily dead.  He got hit by a car while attending to a broken down truck- not alert enough.  Sometimes warnings aren't adequate, sometimes things just happen.

   

                                              Bill Sullivan 

  [/b] 	
[b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 7:04 am Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

Rick:

  

 I doubt very seriously Mr Sullivan got a whole lot  of instruction in one orientation ride.

  

 As pertains to how fast or slow to taxi,  I shared my experience yesterday in my reply to Bill Sullivan's  post:

  

  "I mentioned to Vic the other day on the Kolb List,  taxi speeds, to me, are perceived ground speeds of a fast walk or  less, not 25 to 30 mph.  Anything faster than that, and you are either  transitioning from a landing or taking off."

  

 john h

 mkIII

  

  



 [quote]    

   Bill, At least here on the forum, I see no one has answered your    question about how fast to taxi. I'll give you the answer as it has been    drilled into me by every flight instructor I've ever trained with. Walking    speed. Taxi as fast as you walk. Not jog, not trot, not run. Walk. Which makes    taxiing about as much fun as riding a garden tractor, as it should be. If your    instructor didn't explain this to you, give serious thought to finding a new    instructor. If he didn't give you explicit instruction when he released you to    do slow taxiing, in what else has he been remiss?   



   Rick

    



[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

slyck(at)frontiernet.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:43 am Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

How fast I taxi depends on whether the harness is snapped on...   -but seriously, there are factors, such as gusty conditions (a crawl)

pavement: slow because of weak brakes, more twitchy tail reaction.

my long grass: go for it, get a thrill!

BB

On 28, Sep 2008, at 11:04 AM, John Hauck wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  Rick:

 

I doubt very seriously Mr Sullivan got a whole lot of instruction in one orientation ride.

 

As pertains to how fast or slow to taxi, I shared my experience yesterday in my reply to Bill Sullivan's post:

 

"I mentioned to Vic the other day on the Kolb List, taxi speeds, to me, are perceived ground speeds of a fast walk or less, not 25 to 30 mph.  Anything faster than that, and you are either transitioning from a landing or taking off."

 

john h

mkIII

 

 



 	  Quote: 	
		   

Bill, At least here on the forum, I see no one has answered your question about how fast to taxi. I'll give you the answer as it has been drilled into me by every flight instructor I've ever trained with. Walking speed. Taxi as fast as you walk. Not jog, not trot, not run. Walk. Which makes taxiing about as much fun as riding a garden tractor, as it should be. If your instructor didn't explain this to you, give serious thought to finding a new instructor. If he didn't give you explicit instruction when he released you to do slow taxiing, in what else has he been remiss?



Rick

 



http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List

href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com

href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution



	
	


 [quote][b]

williamtsullivan(at)att.n
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 9:36 am Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

How about we keep it as simple as possible for the beginners.  Taxi speed equals walking speed.

   Another one that I did pick up from the List-  Keep the stick back and apply power gently when starting to taxi, otherwise the Kolb might nose over.

  

                                            Bill Sullivan

 [quote][b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 10:08 am Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

Bill S:

  

 I get the impression you are trying to learn to fly  on the Kolb List.  This would be the last place I attempted to learn to  fly.  First place I would go would be a competent flight  instructor.

  

 If I am wrong, promptly correct me and I will get  on with my chores.

  

 john h

 mkIII

  

  

 [quote]    

                               How about we keep it as simple as possible for the          beginners.     Another one that I did pick up from the          List-  Keep the stick back and apply power gently when starting to          taxi, otherwise the Kolb might nose over.

          

                                                             Bill Sullivan

 	  Quote: 	
		   	
[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Luke

Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 13
Location: Southern CO

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 10:52 am Post subject: Re: Kolb List re: platypus hop

 	  Quote: 	
		  I get the impression you are trying to learn to fly on the Kolb List. 	




I'm a lurker here myself, and it appears Bill S. is not trying to learn how to fly here on the Kolb List, but simply gain helpful advice and ideas. If I had my own Kolb and was just learning how to fly it I would definitely have an instructor to show me the straight and narrow, but even still the wisdom of you all would be very helpful and informative.



I enjoy reading everyones advice and techniques, since i don't have a Kolb to play with myself 



FWIW

_________________
"The LORD is a warrior; the LORD is his name." Exodus 15:3

williamtsullivan(at)att.n
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:29 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

John-  I am not looking to learn to fly here, except for peculiarities to Kolbs.  My intent was to learn from scratch in an LSA ( a CT Sport out of Northampton, Mass.), and then transition to an ultralight, then to the Kolb.  If we ever get some good weather, I'll start again.  They just got a new CT.  

   I was trying to get you and others to give the lurkers some basics, especially pertaining to the Kolb types.  Sorry you misunderstood.  

   I would like to hear of incidents and mistakes by others, so they can be averted.  

   Also, how on earth did you manage to deploy that hand-held parachute?  Tell more stories, please.

  

                                                 Bill Sullivan

 [quote][b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:36 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

Bill S:

  

 Think you are getting the horse before the  cart.

  

 Learn to fly with a competent instructor.  Get  a little air sense.  Go through Ground School.  Seems that would be a  good thing to do since you are busted up at this time, and can probably handle  the class room work.  Learn the basic terminology of aviation, aircraft,  and flying.  That is the normal place to start.  After you learn to  fly, then you can get familiar with type.

  

 Nothing peculiar about Kolbs.  They are little  conventional three axis controlled aircraft.  The differences between other  models of GA and experimental/ultralight/SLA aircraft pertain to Kolbs as  well.

  

 The Kolb List Archives are full of "incidents  and mistakes by others", yours included.

  

 I think both hand deployed parachute saves are in  the archives.  If not, I'll share them with you the first time we  meet.

  

 I am not trying to be critical of you.  I  am trying to get you to see "reality".  If I am headed in the wrong  direction, let me know and I'll go do my chores.  

  

 Gravity is not prejudice.  It affects me same  as it does you.  I too, have discovered several times, the earth is very  hard.

  

 john h - 2,869.1 hours

 mkIII -        300.6 hours 

   

  

  

  

 [quote]    

                             John-  

          

         I am not looking to learn to fly here, except for peculiarities to          Kolbs.   

          

          I was trying to get you and others to give the lurkers some          basics, especially pertaining to the Kolb types.

             

          I would like to hear of incidents and mistakes by others, so          they can be averted.

          

          Also, how on earth did you manage to deploy that hand-held          parachute?  Tell more stories, please.

          

                                                                  Bill Sullivan

 	  Quote: 	
		   	
[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

williamtsullivan(at)att.n
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:48 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

John-  Not really getting it backwards, just had the opportunity to purchase the Kolb, and was starting the instruction.  Remember, I'm not in a hurry.

   I have always had a lot of trouble with gravity.  Every time I drop something it goes ALL the way down.  I am considering suing the estate of Isaac Newton.  We never had this kind of trouble before he thought up laws for gravity.  They have all that money from all of those fig bars, anyway.  I can sue- it's my right as an American.

   Love to here the detailed stories.  One of these days, John.  Meanwhile, I'll poke around in the archives.

  

 do not archive

                                                          Bill Sullivan

 [quote][b]

russ(at)rkiphoto.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:55 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

BillYou're quite right about keeping the stick back to avoid a nose-over. BUT with a headwind,  if a strong gust on the nose hits you, you'll be airborne instantly. If the stick is forward, a gust will simply lift the tail

Also, with a strong tailwind and the stick back, the wind hits the underside of the elevators and can cause a nose-over

Every situation is different but this is something to keep in mind.

Keeping the stick back all the time isn't good advice.

do not archive

Russ Kinne

On Sep 28, 2008, at 1:34 PM, william sullivan wrote:

[quote]  How about we keep it as simple as possible for the beginners.  Taxi speed equals walking speed.

   Another one that I did pick up from the List-  Keep the stick back and apply power gently when starting to taxi, otherwise the Kolb might nose over.

  

                                            Bill Sullivan

  	  Quote: 	
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[b]

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:03 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

At 06:55 PM 9/28/2008, russ kinne wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  Bill

You're quite right about keeping the stick back to avoid a nose-over. BUT 

with a headwind,  if a strong gust on the nose hits you, you'll be 

airborne instantly. If the stick is forward, a gust will simply lift the tail

Also, with a strong tailwind and the stick back, the wind hits the 

underside of the elevators and can cause a nose-over

Every situation is different but this is something to keep in mind.

Keeping the stick back all the time isn't good advice.


	


Crosswind taxi technique (really, not crosswind but any wind direction) and 

where to hold the stick for the various directions is a basic technique, 

taught to all students before solo... at least, before INTENTIONAL solos!



-Dana

--

  The sex was so good that even the neighbors had a cigarette.

aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:12 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

John, All these re:, RE:, SPAM re:, etc make conversations hard to follow and sometimes they get updated in the darndest order. All I had was Bill's how fast to taxi question at the time I responded.  As for how much info Bill did or didn't get on an orientation flight, his statement:"We (the students) were given permission for slow taxiing" implies the instructor gave his endorsement to the activity, does it not? 

 There is nothing in FAR 61.87 or 61.195 which allows an instructor to release a student for solo taxiing. The student doesn't do anything in the airplane solo until he/she is signed off for solo flight. 



Rick  On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 4:36 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		         Bill S:

  

 Think you are getting the horse before the  cart.

  

 Learn to fly with a competent instructor.  Get  a little air sense.  Go through Ground School.  Seems that would be a  good thing to do since you are busted up at this time, and can probably handle  the class room work.  Learn the basic terminology of aviation, aircraft,  and flying.  That is the normal place to start.  After you learn to  fly, then you can get familiar with type.

  

 Nothing peculiar about Kolbs.  They are little  conventional three axis controlled aircraft.  The differences between other  models of GA and experimental/ultralight/SLA aircraft pertain to Kolbs as  well.

  

 The Kolb List Archives are full of "incidents  and mistakes by others", yours included.

  

 I think both hand deployed parachute saves are in  the archives.  If not, I'll share them with you the first time we  meet.

  

 I am not trying to be critical of you.  I  am trying to get you to see "reality".  If I am headed in the wrong  direction, let me know and I'll go do my chores.  

  

 Gravity is not prejudice.  It affects me same  as it does you.  I too, have discovered several times, the earth is very  hard.

  

 john h - 2,869.1 hours

 mkIII -        300.6 hours 

   

  

  

  

  	  Quote: 	
		      

                             John-  

          

         I am not looking to learn to fly here, except for peculiarities to          Kolbs.   

          

          I was trying to get you and others to give the lurkers some          basics, especially pertaining to the Kolb types.

             

          I would like to hear of incidents and mistakes by others, so          they can be averted.

          

          Also, how on earth did you manage to deploy that hand-held          parachute?  Tell more stories, please.

          

                                                                  Bill Sullivan

 	  Quote: 	
		   	
	
    [/b] 	


[b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:20 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

Rick:

  

 That's why I attempt to cut and paste referenced  msg.  Hopefully, I leave enough of the original msg so folks know what I am  talking about.

  

 john h

 mkIII

  

  

 [quote]    



   John, All these re:, RE:, SPAM re:, etc make conversations hard    to follow and sometimes they get updated in the darndest order.  

      Rick

    

     

          	  Quote: 	
		             

     Think you are getting the horse before the      cart.

      

     john h - 2,869.1 hours

      

       

      

      

      

      	  Quote: 	
		          

                                                 John-  

              

             I am not looking to learn to fly here, except for peculiarities              to Kolbs.   

              

              

                                                                          Bill Sullivan

 	  Quote: 	
		   	
	
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p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List

ics.com

.matronics.com/contribution



	
[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:24 pm Post subject: Kolb List re: Platypus hop

At 07:12 PM 9/28/2008, Richard Girard wrote:



  	  Quote: 	
		  There is nothing in FAR 61.87 or 61.195 which allows an instructor to release a student for solo taxiing. The student doesn't do anything in the airplane solo until he/she is signed off for solo flight. 	


 Neither of which apply to Part 103 ultralights, which is what Bill [accidentally] flew.



 Still, I seem to recall (been a long time, I could be misremembering) my instructor having me taxi the C-150 over to the fuel pumps alone before I soloed, if the plane needed fuel and he had something to do before flying with me.



 -Dana

 --

  The sex was so good that even the neighbors had a cigarette.    [quote][b]

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