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lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1490
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:20 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

I have been putting off sending this due to shame and a plain  reluctance to admit that I could do anything so patently stupid. However one  cannot stick their heads in the sand forever. I managed to cause myself another  major repair problem a couple of weeks ago. The short version is that I managed  to get behind the power curve in a slow flight much too close to the ground.  (Kolb Pilot Quit) Probably another five feet of altitude or if I had kept my  eyes on the airspeed indicator this miserable letter would never have to have  been written. As it is the axle "Y" fitting broke on contact with the ground,  the gear leg dug into the soft ground resulting in a crushed nose cone and a few  bent tubes. Every thing is repairable, I even straightened the gear leg, it only  takes time and money. 

   

 While I have nothing but praise for the Firestar and the  ability of the cage to absorb shock, (I didn't even have a sore muscle from the  incident, except for kicking my own butt. ) I cannot quite speak as highly of  the axle socket or the gear legs for that matter. While I cannot deny that the  poor things shouldn't be subjected to the stresses that I have so callously  asked them to withstand, I wish they were tougher. I understand that by their  being the weakest part of the system that it might save some of the other parts  of the cage. However when the leg snaps off or the axle breaks  the  rest of the cage is going to suffer as well. If the wheel had been able to stay  on and just bounced rather than allowing the leg to dig into the ground, I  cannot help but believe that the damage would have been substantially less. I  hopefully will be getting some of the 4130 gear legs this spring, and perhaps I  can talk Terry into building me some tougher axle Y's as well. I would have  expected the gear leg to collapse, but the gear leg was OK, the damn axle Y  broke.

  

 If I planned to stick to airports and other civilized environs  then none of this would be a consideration, but I haven't, and most likely  won't. 

  

 Larry C

  

 do not archive

   [quote][b]

_________________
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John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:39 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

Hi Larry:

  

 Sorry to hear about your gear leg/axle socket failure.   Been there and done that.  The exception was it chose to fail 3,742 miles  from home, Muncho Lake, British Columbia, Canada, 1 July 2000.

  

 I could have prevented this failure had I taken Brother Jim's  advice when we were fabricating gear legs and axle sockets.  He wanted to  weld the axle socket to the end of the gear leg.  I liked using the gear  leg/axle socket because if was easier to align the main gear.  Wish I had  taken his advice.

  

 When we rebuilt the mkIII we welded .120 wall axle sockets to  the end of the 4130 legs.  Don't think we will be losing a wheel anytime  soon.

  

 john h

 mkIII

  

  

  

 [quote]   If I planned to stick to airports and other civilized    environs then none of this would be a consideration, but I haven't, and most    likely won't. 

    

   Larry C

    

[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

slyck(at)frontiernet.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:42 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

Sounds like some damage I'm recently familiar with (Thom?)  To his credit heuttered but one singular cuss word after exiting his inverted FS.  Admirable self control.

BB

BTW I would fabricate tougher Y axle fittings.

do not archive



On 4, Mar 2008, at 3:17 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  I have been putting off sending this due to shame and a plain reluctance to admit that I could do anything so patently stupid. However one cannot stick their heads in the sand forever. I managed to cause myself another major repair problem a couple of weeks ago. The short version is that I managed to get behind the power curve in a slow flight much too close to the ground. (Kolb Pilot Quit) Probably another five feet of altitude or if I had kept my eyes on the airspeed indicator this miserable letter would never have to have been written. As it is the axle "Y" fitting broke on contact with the ground, the gear leg dug into the soft ground resulting in a crushed nose cone and a few bent tubes. Every thing is repairable, I even straightened the gear leg, it only takes time and money.

 

While I have nothing but praise for the Firestar and the ability of the cage to absorb shock, (I didn't even have a sore muscle from the incident, except for kicking my own butt. ) I cannot quite speak as highly of the axle socket or the gear legs for that matter. While I cannot deny that the poor things shouldn't be subjected to the stresses that I have so callously asked them to withstand, I wish they were tougher. I understand that by their being the weakest part of the system that it might save some of the other parts of the cage. However when the leg snaps off or the axle breaks  the rest of the cage is going to suffer as well. If the wheel had been able to stay on and just bounced rather than allowing the leg to dig into the ground, I cannot help but believe that the damage would have been substantially less. I hopefully will be getting some of the 4130 gear legs this spring, and perhaps I can talk Terry into building me some tougher axle Y's as well. I would have expected the gear leg to collapse, but the gear leg was OK, the damn axle Y broke.

 

If I planned to stick to airports and other civilized environs then none of this would be a consideration, but I haven't, and most likely won't.

 

Larry C

 

do not archive

 	  Quote: 	
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HShack(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:02 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

I don't know how thick you want them, but about 3-4 years ago I ordered new  Y's & they were much thicker than the originals.

  

 Howard  Shackleford

FS II

SC   

  In a message dated 3/4/2008 3:21:15 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  lcottrell(at)fmtcblue.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  and perhaps I can talk Terry into building me some tougher axle Y's as    well. I would have expected the gear leg to collapse, but the gear leg was OK,    the damn axle Y  broke. 	






It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & Finance.

  [quote][b]

Bob Dalton

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 68
Location: Manteca, Ca

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 6:54 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

Larry,  

   

Glad your okay, now get her fixed up so we can read and see those great high desert trips you take and share with us. And gosh-darnnit be careful!  

     

Bob  Dalton  

wiserguy(at)comcast.net  

        

  

From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell

 Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 12:17 PM

 To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: X(at)#$(at)#%*XX  

  

     

I have been putting off sending this due to shame and a plain reluctance to admit that I could do anything so patently stupid. However one cannot stick their heads in the sand forever. I managed to cause myself another major repair problem a couple of weeks ago. The short version is that I managed to get behind the power curve in a slow flight much too close to the ground. (Kolb Pilot Quit) Probably another five feet of altitude or if I had kept my eyes on the airspeed indicator this miserable letter would never have to have been written. As it is the axle "Y" fitting broke on contact with the ground, the gear leg dug into the soft ground resulting in a crushed nose cone and a few bent tubes. Every thing is repairable, I even straightened the gear leg, it only takes time and money.   

    

    

    

While I have nothing but praise for the Firestar and the ability of the cage to absorb shock, (I didn't even have a sore muscle from the incident, except for kicking my own butt. ) I cannot quite speak as highly of the axle socket or the gear legs for that matter. While I cannot deny that the poor things shouldn't be subjected to the stresses that I have so callously asked them to withstand, I wish they were tougher. I understand that by their being the weakest part of the system that it might save some of the other parts of the cage. However when the leg snaps off or the axle breaks  the rest of the cage is going to suffer as well. If the wheel had been able to stay on and just bounced rather than allowing the leg to dig into the ground, I cannot help but believe that the damage would have been substantially less. I hopefully will be getting some of the 4130 gear legs this spring, and perhaps I can talk Terry into building me some tougher axle Y's as well. I would have expected the gear leg to collapse, but the gear leg was OK, the damn axle Y broke.  

    

   

    

If I planned to stick to airports and other civilized environs then none of this would be a consideration, but I haven't, and most likely won't.   

    

   

    

Larry C  

    

   

    

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_________________
Bob Dalton
Manteca, Ca.
wiserguy@comcast.net

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1490
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 8:31 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

[quote] ---

_________________
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customersupport(at)tnkolb
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:17 am Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

larry, sorry to here you had a bad landing, the  axle fittings have been beefed up for a long time now, you may want to order 2  because the one you have ordered will not match,they are much better  now.   donnie at kolb.

 [quote]   ---

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:44 am Post subject: Re: X@#$@#%*XX

Larry,

Welcome to the stupid stunt club, or as you put it, Kolb PILOT Quit. As BB mentioned I had a similar incident last August, fortunately at BB's place, and not 3700 miles from home as was John H's. It has been way too cold in these parts to do any work on the FS in a frigid hangar but will get back to work on it when upstate NY spring arrives... in another couple of months .

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:27 am Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

Larry Cottrell wrote: 



<< ... the axle "Y" fitting broke on contact with the ground, the gear

leg dug into the soft ground resulting in a crushed nose cone and a few

bent tubes. >>



"You can't break 'em if you don't fly 'em." 

					John Hauck



<< If I planned to stick to airports and other civilized environs then

none of this would be a consideration, but I haven't, and most likely

won't. >>



"Don't land anywhere you don't want to be broken down at."

					John Williamson"

Dear Larry -



Sorry to hear of your recent mishap.  Believe me, I know how it feels to

damage your airplane because of ... being human, as we are.



I hope you don't take offense to my posting these sanguine quotes from

two of our fellow Kolbers.  Ya gotta admit - their words ring true!



Good luck in gettin' your Firestar back in the air soon, Amigo -



Dennis Kirby

Cedar Crest, NM

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lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1490
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:52 am Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

---

_________________
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Jim ODay

Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 61
Location: Fargo North Dakota

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 2:17 pm Post subject: Re: X@#$@#%*XX

Bummer on the mishap Larry.    



How can I determine if I have the "beefed up" part?



Here is a pic of mine  - http://myweb.cableone.net/oday/Kolb/Wheel%20Brake.jpg

Thanks.



Fly safe.



Jim

_________________
Jim O'Day
Fargo, ND
Former Firestar II Builder/Pilot

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 3:02 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

> How can I determine if I have the "beefed up" part?

 >

 	  Quote: 	
		   Jim


	




Jim:



Call Kolb.  Ask them what wall thickness they are using for the new beefed 

up gear leg/axle sockets.



Get out the calipers and go from there.



Looks like yours may be thin wall stuff.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1490
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 4:45 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

 	  Quote: 	
		   > How can I determine if I have the "beefed up" part?

 >

> Jim

 Jim:



 Call Kolb.  Ask them what wall thickness they are using for the new beefed 

 up gear leg/axle sockets.



 Get out the calipers and go from there.



 Looks like yours may be thin wall stuff.



 john h

 mkIII


	


I just went out and measured mine and it looks as though the wall thickness 

is 65 thousands. I have to agree with John, yours looks like the thin wall 

stuff.

Larry C



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_________________
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John Bickham

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 170
Location: St. Francisville, LA

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:23 pm Post subject: Re: X@#$@#%*XX

Larry C,



Know how you feel right now.  Bent my plane not being the smartest pilot in some changing weather conditions on the way to MV in 2004.  You get pretty mad at yourself and feel like a walking idiot.  Been there myself.



John H gave me some good advice when this happened to me.  Take the opportunity to do all the little mods to make your plane better.  Stuff you've been wanting to do, just didn't want to take the time and stop flying.



Although it took a long time,  my plane bending turned out to be a really good thing.  Could have been a fatal accident.  Now, life and flying a bit different.  Less priority on work, more on family and fun.  Plane is a lot better now.  Flies better and everything.  



Stop kicking yourself so hard.  More than are willing to admit have made bigger mistakes than you have.  Only way not to screw up, is to do absolutely nothing.



Peace be with you.

_________________
Thanks too much,

John Bickham
Mark III-C w/ 912UL
St. Francisville, LA

I know many pilots and a few true aviators. There is a distinct difference that I have the greatest respect for.

Steven Green

Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 118

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 6:04 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

---

_________________
Steven Green

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1490
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 6:27 pm Post subject: X@#$@#%*XX

 	  Quote: 	
		  >

> None taken, I don't think any of you, could say anything to me that I 

> haven't already said to myself, in much harsher language. Surprisingly 

> Karen has not said even one word about the incident.

 Have you told Her about it yet?



 Steven



 Do not archive


	




Now that one made me laugh. No way to keep from it, When I crested the rise 

in the strip she was outside waiting for me.  Married 44 years not much 

gets by her.

Larry C

_________________
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