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Flying to the UK

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air.guerner(at)wanadoo.fr
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 2:50 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

Salut Gilles, 

I have  flown my Europa to the UK many times without problems. But CAP455  / AN52 is an all new CAA requirement dated September 2006 which replaces previous rules. It says that any one which does not comply is liable for prosecution.  

Remi 

  

Rmi Guerner a crit :

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 Up to now, no exemption was necessary for homebuilts. This was based 

 on reciprocal agreements such as: the French authorities recognize PFA 

 aircraft and allow them to fly to France without prior permission, 

 then the UK authorities do the same with French homebuits. Same thing 

 between most European countries (Spain and Italy are still exceptions 

 to this reasonable rule, as far as I know).



  



 Having to apply for an exemption before each visit to the UK will be 

 another burden (added to high landing fees and the typical British 

 weather!) and will contribute to dissuade most of us to fly to the UK. 

 What a pity!



  




	


Rmi,



You don't need to ask in the European Community.

Further, when you ask a permission that is not needed, you put the 

"bureaucrat" in front of you in a position to say no. And then he'll ask 

his boss, who won't know and ask his own boss, etc...



Many French MCRs regularly go to Britain without any problem.



 	  Quote: 	
		   "Recommendation TNT. S11-1 of the European-Civil Aviation Conference 

 (ECAC),

 > adopted at the eleventh Intermediate Session of ECAC in June 1980 states: 

 >

 > That Member States accept home-built aircraft with a Certificate of

 > Airworthiness or a Permit to Fly issued by another Member State, to fly in

 > their country without any restrictions other than those stated in the

 > Certificate of Airworthiness or Permit to Fly.

 >  

 >

 > 2     All ECAC Member States agreed to the recommendation and, in October

 > 1984, CAA implemented it on behalf of the United Kingdom by issuing an

 > Exemption, in the terms set out in Issue 1 of this Airworthiness Notice,

 > from compliance with the appropriate provisions of the Air Navigation Order

 > relating to Certificates of Airworthiness."

Hope this helps,
	




Amicalement,

Gilles,

   [quote][b]

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Gilles.Thesee(at)ac-greno
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:01 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

RÃ©mi Guerner a Ã©crit :

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 Salut Gilles,



 I have  flown my Europa to the UK many times without problems. But 

 CAP455  / AN52 is an all new CAA requirement dated September 2006 

 which replaces previous rules. It says that any one which does not 

 comply is liable for prosecution.


	


RÃ©mi,



I forgot that the UK is hardly in the European Community ))

Seriously now, where can we have a full copy of the text you referred to ?

Does it explicitly  supersede  the previous  Exemption ?



Regards,

Gilles

http://contrails.free.fr

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m.j.gregory(at)talk21.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:13 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

Hello Gilles,



The whole of CAP455 (1.5 MB) can be downloaded free from the UK CAA web site

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP455.PDF 

Airworthiness Notice 52 explains that the previous block exemption for

foreign home-built aircraft has been superseded by splitting the requirement

into two: automatic clearance for a visit of up to 28 days may be obtained

by e-mailing the completed form set out in AN 52 to a special address;

visits of more than 28 days require special authorisation by the UK CAA.

The intention is apparently to avoid people operating "permit" aircraft in

the UK on a long-term basis without meeting the UK airworthiness standards.



You are always welcome here!



Mike

Europa Club Safety Officer



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Gilles.Thesee(at)ac-greno
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:36 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

Mike Gregory a écrit :

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Hello Gilles,



 The whole of CAP455 (1.5 MB) can be downloaded free from the UK CAA web site

 http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP455.PDF 

 Airworthiness Notice 52 explains that the previous block exemption for

 foreign home-built aircraft has been superseded by splitting the requirement

 into two

 You are always welcome here!



   

Mike,
	




Thank you for the link and your welcome.

I was hoping to fly to the UK in the summer.



Best regards,

Gilles

http://contrails.free.fr

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john(at)greenleas.freeser
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 9:12 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

According to my reading of AN52 it says that foreign registered homebuilts

must apply for permission to fly in the UK but Appendix 1 exempts EC

homebuilts from the need to do so providing they comply with a few

conditions as follows:-



(a) The aircraft shall not be flown over any assembly of persons or over any

congested area of a city, town or settlement.



(b) The aircraft shall not be flown for the purpose of public transport or

aerial work.



(c) The aircraft shall be flown only in accordance with daytime Visual

Flight Rules.



(d) The conditions, limitations and restrictions applicable under the Permit

to Fly or equivalent document issued by the State of Registry shall be

observed.



(e) The aircraft shall not remain in the United Kingdom pursuant to this

exemption for more than 28 days in any one calendar year.



(f) Prior to each visit to the UK, the aircraft owner shall provide to the

CAA the information specified in Schedule 1 to this exemption.



(g) The owner of the aircraft shall ensure that the documents specified in

Schedule 2 to this exemption are available for inspection by the CAA on

demand when the aircraft is in the UK.

---

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m.j.gregory(at)talk21.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:01 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

Exactly so, John.  For visits of up to 28 days, the information on an EC

registered homebuilt must be supplied in accordance with (f) to be exempt

from making an application to the CAA.  This is what I loosely referred to

as "automatic clearance".  It is just a matter of completing the AN 52 form

and e-mailing it to an52exemption(at)srg.caa.co.uk to receive an automatic

reply that is the authority for the visit.  Alternatively, the completed

form could be sent to the UK CAA by post.



I accept that what is being done here is providing information to the CAA to

comply with the exemption conditions, rather than applying for permission to

fly in the UK, but it still means that the CAA requirement must be fulfilled

by taking action in advance for each and every visit.  This is not quite the

same as having carte blanche to fly to the UK without prior notification.



Regards



Mike



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Gilles.Thesee(at)ac-greno
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:47 am Post subject: Flying to the UK

Mike Gregory a écrit :

 	  Quote: 	
		    This is not quite the

 same as having carte blanche to fly to the UK without prior notification.

   


	


You bet !

Some of my buddies report flying to many European countries without 

anything but a flight plan.

I'm wondering if the French Aviation Civile also revoked the 1980 

agreement ? Or is it only the UK ?



Regards,

Gilles

http://contrails.free.fr

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